HP Regen

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Dakan
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HP Regen

Post by Dakan »

[18:34] 45/475 34/50 - >rest
You crouch down and then lie back to rest your tired bones.
[18:57] 475/475 50/50 - >

23 minutes for regen.

Could we up HP regen? It really sucks to get gibbed down 400+ hp and have to sit for 20+ minutes before oyu can play again.
Keruk
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Keruk »

I believe there are items in the game that you can sit on which help with regen. I believe that would cut your regen time significantly.
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Sahrine
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Sahrine »

We know about blankets and pillows, Keruk. Thanks though. They do help, but I don't think that's what Dakan is driving at.
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Master Sylibus
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Master Sylibus »

Utilize blankets and pillows. I find it doesn't take that long to regen health even from such a low amount using them. I think it's somewhere around 3 hp each time the thing tics which is HUGE. If you don't want to use these tools at your disposal then that's up to your own discretion I suppose. :P

EDIT: Tested it and looks like it cuts the downtime by around half. Meaning about 10-12 mins to go from deadish to full depending on your hps and if there is a character regen rate.
Dakan
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Dakan »

Honestly the pillow seems more like a bandaid to me.

When you have an entire group of like 6 people smobbing and the solution to low hp regen is for everyone to use a blanket/pillow whatever, it's not a 'tool' at your disposal.

It's not a tool because you can buy one to last you forever. It takes no practice points, no skills, no energy, no mvs, no nothing. A level 1 with 50 coins can go get one and use the same one from 1 to 51.

A tool would be getting survival to increase your regen rate. Each 10% increase regen rate +1 hp per 30 seconds. At 70% you'd get +7 hp every 30 seconds.

A tool would be getting little health potions made by wisdoms or herbalists.

A tool is a channeler healing you.

A tool would be the ability to make and use bandaids.


Blankets aren't -tools-, they might as well load in newbie kits.
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Sahrine
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Sahrine »

right. I agree with Dakan. Once again... we already know about blankets. They're super helpful. They're awesome. They are cheap and their weight really doesn't affect defense anymore.

But that underlying issue is still there. The fact that blankets even exist to address the enormous time it takes to regen is proof that this is seen as an issue by even the imms who made blankets useful.
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Master Sylibus
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Master Sylibus »

I like that you fleshed out your argument a bit better in the subsequent post, Dakan. Offering suggestions is a bit more constructive and will likely get considered more. Either way, I'm sure many others would like to see things such as regen sped up a bit.

And I know you that you know about blankets already. Just the initial post was one not utilizing one and asking for a fix when there was something that you could have potentially used. Don't get me wrong, I know it would be a bit of a hassle to use in smob situations and I understand all of that. And I understand that not everyone can afford countless time spent regenning which sucks especially when you're put into situations like that.

The blankets are a nice RP piece. If regen were upgraded they would just potentially get taken out in lieu of adding that blanket regen to you once you spent enough time resting. Also I would think that smob regen would be increased as well in order to balance out the quicker regeneration which would have to be considered unless things were meant to become easier for us. Other than the underlying issue that regen is a problem, there are balance issues at hand too that I think need to be considered.
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Sahrine
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Sahrine »

Blankets really are a nice RP piece, I'll agree with that much. If only they worked properly.

Now, Belgar did a fantastic job. I will not go on any serious outing without a blanket. Belgar made blankets -essential-. But still, they don't work. Consider campfires.

As far as balance goes.. could you maybe explain further, Sylibus? Because as far as I know, unless you have a talent or bonus that's available to only certain ranks of certain clans, everyone regens at the same rate - not considering things like rooms, terrain, or items (blankets). And correct me if I am wrong, but Trollocs can't buy blankets and don't have a similar perk?

So if that is the case, it is already currently unbalanced.

Also, smobs will have be the same if regen is increased. Increased regen will make smobbing easier. This is already the case because blankets are here to make it so.

So at the baseline, consider that 20 minutes for an average player to regenerate fully is too much, regardless of blankets or whatever bonused characters have - because bonuses should take you above the appropriate norm. The -norm- is where the issue lies.

Perhaps increasing normal regen would make regen bonuses less desirable. I consider this side by side with other 'bonuses' that have been moderated to be less OP, like the variation in channie strengths, some items no longer have the stats they used to have (i can only assume because abs wearers don't have comparable slots), and physical stats not really mattering that much.

So what Dakan is asking for, and what I also agree with, isn't really that out of line with how other things already are.
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Master Sylibus
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Master Sylibus »

Sahrine wrote:As far as balance goes.. could you maybe explain further, Sylibus? Because as far as I know, unless you have a talent or bonus that's available to only certain ranks of certain clans, everyone regens at the same rate - not considering things like rooms, terrain, or items (blankets). And correct me if I am wrong, but Trollocs can't buy blankets and don't have a similar perk?

So if that is the case, it is already currently unbalanced.
I do think characters have varying regeneration rates. There are a lot of balance issues already in the game I'm not going to lie. What I was getting at is that people can just throw themselves at a smob over and over again without any real strategy while they themselves regenerate at an increased rate. This would further trivialize the smob thus I think the smob regen rate would need to be compensated to counteract such thing. That's what I'm getting at. Trollocs are a whole different issue. They already have monstrous health and I don't think they're even anywhere close in line to what Wetlanders are so I find bringing that up moot.
Sahrine wrote:Also, smobs will have be the same if regen is increased. Increased regen will make smobbing easier. This is already the case because blankets are here to make it so.
Blankets are a little added perk. You either bring them or you don't. Those who are prepared, which is very important, will make sure to do so. Those who decide against it are just hindering themselves. Sure it's annoying but even though it's a "bandaid" fix I find that it's sufficient. And I'd be down with regeneration if smobs were regenerating at about the same rate we had our regeneration increased by. I already pointed out why this would be needed. And in the end it will make smobbing faster regardless I just want to make sure it doesn't make it /too/ fast is all.
Sahrine wrote:So at the baseline, consider that 20 minutes for an average player to regenerate fully is too much, regardless of blankets or whatever bonused characters have - because bonuses should take you above the appropriate norm. The -norm- is where the issue lies.

Perhaps increasing normal regen would make regen bonuses less desirable. I consider this side by side with other 'bonuses' that have been moderated to be less OP, like the variation in channie strengths, some items no longer have the stats they used to have (i can only assume because abs wearers don't have comparable slots), and physical stats not really mattering that much.
I understand that 20 mins is too much for a high health player to regenerate from nearly dead to full. If the baseline were cut in half and blankets removed, would that make things okay? The idea of adding regeneration to survival is a good idea because it would mean that those clans that can master survival will get that "bonus". Completely removing blankets out of the game would then be needed because it would just make regen far too fast I think. Examples were given before hand due to the whole smob issue. I'm sure a steady but decent rate of regeneration could be found without people running out of things to kill.
Sahrine wrote:So what Dakan is asking for, and what I also agree with, isn't really that out of line with how other things already are.
Never said anything about it being out of line. Was just stating an opinion on the matter. Pointing out the other discrepancies in the game though isn't a good way to go about things. The survival regen thing is a good idea and I think that's about the most reasonable "fix" I can see while keeping everything else in mind.
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Niila
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Re: HP Regen

Post by Niila »

Health regeneration is indeed fairly slow, I'll agree with what has been said about that. That being said, I'll also have to give insight to as why it is like it is right now:

a) To give usefulness to blankets/pillows/regenerative items. This is an RP bit, but not really anything else. But as the MUD's point has always been roleplay, small roleplay elements have always been encouraged. The problem is the 'getting up' upon being healed by the blanket, which is an irritation. I'll try to fix it sometime in the future.

b) To give healing weaves a purpose. Healing weaves are meant to be a tremendous boon to those capable of performing them (and having them, in the case of higher healing weaves). If you could regenerate a lot more faster, then the usefulness of having healing weaves would reduce a lot, perhaps even become completely reduntant due to the 'negative' sides that they also have.

c) To give healing vials a purpose. These vials were introduced so that players would have a reason to make trade with Wisdoms. They speed up regen by quite a lot, and while they might be slightly expensive or difficult to make, the boost they give is fairly high.


Those are the reasons why regeneration hasn't been touched in ages, because the usefulness of all the three have been wanted to be kept.

Maxim was working on an alternative system for regeneration, but it didn't come to fruition. In that system, you'd have regenerated faster at 25-75% of your health, but if you were below that or above that, you regenerated a bit slower as you went further from them. This was to give grave wounds or reaching 'top health' take time, but less time in between.

Regen is a delicate issue. On one hand, it can be fairly powerful if over the top(as demonstrated in the past by warders having obscure regen..) and yet at other hand, it's quite boring to wait for 22 minutes for your health to regenerate.

Oh, and regeneration is the same for both mobs and players. The suggested changes would indeed 'buff' both. If we'd buff up regen, we'd likely get rid of some of the elements mentioned above to balance the field for mobs.

Yours truly,
- Niila

P.S. Level affects regen. As do some of the talents. A level 1 person will regen a lot slower than a level 51 person. :)
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